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     Home »  The William Hartnell Era »  Stupid Questions for the Canon Keepers
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    Stupid Questions for the Canon Keepers Views: 1803
     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 08:47 AM EDT
    Has it ever expressly been stated anywhere in the series that the William Hartnell incarnation was the Doctors First body, i.e., Patrick Troughton was his first regeneration. Or could we be on the Doctor's final regeneration now.

    Additionally, is it established that Christopher Eccleston's Doctor is the regeneration after Paul Mcgann's?

    In the kingdom of the blind, the one-eyed are Kings
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 08:56 AM EDT

    In the Five Doctors #1 ask #5 "Regeneration?" and 5 replys "Fourth." and one responds with "Goodness me there are 5 of me now!" As to the #8 to #9 question, I don't recal a reffrence until School reunion where the Doctor tells Sarah Jane that he has regenerated a good half dozen times since they last met.

    Cheers,
    Mike M.

    I'm a Time Traveler, I point and laugh at archaeologist.
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 09:46 AM EDT
    [Quote  by:  merlin_mccarley]

    In the Five Doctors #1 ask #5 "Regeneration?" and 5 replys "Fourth." and one responds with "Goodness me there are 5 of me now!" As to the #8 to #9 question, I don't recal a reffrence until Scholl reunion where the Doctor tells Sarah Jane that he has regenerated a good half dozen times since they last met.

    Cheers,
    Mike M.


    I'm pretty sure the first doctor is 'the first doctor' - I suppose as well he had lived a long and fairly 'safe' life on Gallifrey.

    It was only after 'borrowing' the type 40 Tardis and leaving that he started to 'use up' his lives so quickly.

    Although of course we don't really know how long some of these 'lives' are what with missing adventures etc.

    Cheers, daveac

    PS - Doctor Whoovie did you see the avitar I posted for you?

    here

    daveac on blip.tv, TalkShoe, iTunes, LiveVideo, uStream, GE, Sci-Fi, DWO, DS & WTA, Dave C on WLP, cooperda on AVF, dac100 on YouTube & PB, dac on Tiscali
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 09:52 AM EDT


    I agree. William Hartnell was the first incarnation of the Doctor... and the first regeneration was into Patrick Troughton. Having said that, it was implied in The Brain of Morbius (a Tom Baker story) that there had been other incarnations of the Doctor before William Hartnell. But in my own personal canon, these other images of the Doctor seen in this story were not of the Doctor but perhaps Morbius instead. Just my way of handling this bit of discontinuity.

    Cheers,
    Louis

    ☛ Follow me on Twitter at http://twitter.com/LouisTrapani ♥ ♥
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 09:54 AM EDT

    In The Brain of Morbius it was implied during the Timelord wrestling match, that the Doctor may have had multiple incarnations before the Hartnell one. This was the intent of the production crew at the time. Currently, it is felt that those were Morbius's incarnations and not the Doctor's.

    Most on screen references are either vague or misleading. The reference sited above is the only one I remember from the television series.

    Now, RTD stated quite clearly that the Eccleston Doctor is the same person as the classic series Doctor and is referred to as the Ninth Doctor. Until we see anything to the contrary, that would be a sane assumption.

    Taras

    Daleks don't accept apologies! YOU WILL BE EXTERMINATED!
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 09:59 AM EDT
    [Quote  by:  tarashnat]
    In The Brain of Morbius it was implied during the Timelord wrestling match, that the Doctor may have had multiple incarnations before the Hartnell one. This was the intent of the production crew at the time. Currently, it is felt that those were Morbius's incarnations and not the Doctor's.

    Most on screen references are either vague or misleading. The reference sited above is the only one I remember from the television series.

    Now, RTD stated quite clearly that the Eccleston Doctor is the same person as the classic series Doctor and is referred to as the Ninth Doctor. Until we see anything to the contrary, that would be a sane assumption.

    Taras


    Just to muddy the waters a bit Evil - we do know that a Time Lord can change his appearance without regenerating - as with Romana 'trying different looks'

    Cheers, daveac

    daveac on blip.tv, TalkShoe, iTunes, LiveVideo, uStream, GE, Sci-Fi, DWO, DS & WTA, Dave C on WLP, cooperda on AVF, dac100 on YouTube & PB, dac on Tiscali
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 10:00 AM EDT

    As to "The Brain of Morbius", even the first time I saw it I believed that the other faces were indeed of Morbius. It rather confounded me when I started reading online speculation that these were the Doctor, glad I am not alone in that "personal canon" view.

    Cheers,
    Mike M.

    I'm a Time Traveler, I point and laugh at archaeologist.
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 11:50 AM EDT
    That was my natural reaction to first-time viewing as well...of course, I assumed that Hartnell was the first. So, I think it works without requiring major retro-fitting. From what I've read, however, the production team's intention was for previous incarnations. But, obviously later stories have contradicted that.

    I'm not much of a continuity nut though. If the story's good, I can easily smooth over some small discontinuities. Hopefully this ability will come in handy as I make my way through the Big Finish catalog. Smile

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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 12:11 PM EDT
    [Quote  by:  daveac]
    [Quote  by:  tarashnat]
    In The Brain of Morbius it was implied during the Timelord wrestling match, that the Doctor may have had multiple incarnations before the Hartnell one. This was the intent of the production crew at the time. Currently, it is felt that those were Morbius's incarnations and not the Doctor's.

    Most on screen references are either vague or misleading. The reference sited above is the only one I remember from the television series.

    Now, RTD stated quite clearly that the Eccleston Doctor is the same person as the classic series Doctor and is referred to as the Ninth Doctor. Until we see anything to the contrary, that would be a sane assumption.

    Taras


    Just to muddy the waters a bit Evil - we do know that a Time Lord can change his appearance without regenerating - as with Romana 'trying different looks'

    Cheers, daveac


    I believe the concensus is that this was a regeneration.

    Daleks don't accept apologies! YOU WILL BE EXTERMINATED!
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 12:16 PM EDT
    [Quote  by:  tarashnat]
    [Quote  by:  daveac]
    [Quote  by:  tarashnat]
    In The Brain of Morbius it was implied during the Timelord wrestling match, that the Doctor may have had multiple incarnations before the Hartnell one. This was the intent of the production crew at the time. Currently, it is felt that those were Morbius's incarnations and not the Doctor's.

    Most on screen references are either vague or misleading. The reference sited above is the only one I remember from the television series.

    Now, RTD stated quite clearly that the Eccleston Doctor is the same person as the classic series Doctor and is referred to as the Ninth Doctor. Until we see anything to the contrary, that would be a sane assumption.

    Taras


    Just to muddy the waters a bit Evil - we do know that a Time Lord can change his appearance without regenerating - as with Romana 'trying different looks'

    Cheers, daveac


    I believe the concensus is that this was a regeneration.


    I don't mean Romana I to Romana II - i mean she tried a number of appearances before settling on 'Romana II' looks.

    Cheers, daveac

    daveac on blip.tv, TalkShoe, iTunes, LiveVideo, uStream, GE, Sci-Fi, DWO, DS & WTA, Dave C on WLP, cooperda on AVF, dac100 on YouTube & PB, dac on Tiscali
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 12:24 PM EDT
    Been a long while since I've seen that episode with Romana regenerating. Didn't she change species as well? Clearly that production team was having a bit of fun.

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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 12:37 PM EDT
    [Quote  by:  daveac]
    [Quote  by:  tarashnat]
    [Quote  by:  daveac]
    [Quote  by:  tarashnat]
    In The Brain of Morbius it was implied during the Timelord wrestling match, that the Doctor may have had multiple incarnations before the Hartnell one. This was the intent of the production crew at the time. Currently, it is felt that those were Morbius's incarnations and not the Doctor's.

    Most on screen references are either vague or misleading. The reference sited above is the only one I remember from the television series.

    Now, RTD stated quite clearly that the Eccleston Doctor is the same person as the classic series Doctor and is referred to as the Ninth Doctor. Until we see anything to the contrary, that would be a sane assumption.

    Taras


    Just to muddy the waters a bit Evil - we do know that a Time Lord can change his appearance without regenerating - as with Romana 'trying different looks'

    Cheers, daveac


    I believe the concensus is that this was a regeneration.


    I don't mean Romana I to Romana II - i mean she tried a number of appearances before settling on 'Romana II' looks.

    Cheers, daveac


    I have heard that refered to as a "controled regeneration". Those "in between" states were just possibilites. And a possible explanition for this can be taken from "The Christmas Invasion" where within the first 15 hours of a regeneration cycle the Doctor was able to "Regrow" a hand. Timelords seem to have varying degrees of controll over the process.

    Cheers,
    Mike M.

    I'm a Time Traveler, I point and laugh at archaeologist.
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 05:51 PM EDT
    [Quote  by:  merlin_mccarley]
    I have heard that refered to as a "controled regeneration". Those "in between" states were just possibilites. And a possible explanition for this can be taken from "The Christmas Invasion" where within the first 15 hours of a regeneration cycle the Doctor was able to "Regrow" a hand. Timelords seem to have varying degrees of controll over the process.


    This makes sense to me, since I don't think the Doctor has ever had a "controlled" regeneration in his entire existence!

    So maybe the way in which Romana regenerated from Romana I to Romana II was the "normal" way most Timelords do it. (Like trying on a new outfit.)

    Did you say "74,384,338 to 1 against"? That's my lucky number!
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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 06:22 PM EDT
    At the end of Troughton's era as he was about to be exiled on Earth he was given a choice on his new appearance.

    "Oh that one's too young! No no no that won't work at all!"

    -cs™

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     Wednesday, May 16 2007 @ 10:36 PM EDT

    One then can assume that a regeneration by choice may be more controllable, at least from what evidence we have on screen.

    Daleks don't accept apologies! YOU WILL BE EXTERMINATED!
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