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The End of Time: Part One - SPOILERS!!!


Idiom's picture

Idiom - Posted on 25 December 2009

Ah, just what the Doctor ordered. Replete with Turkey roast dinner and therefore content, and just one or two cavas to relax and so make sure that I didn't worry too much about any plots holes, I really enjoyed this.

Those worrying that the major plot points had been let out of the bag months before the story started, needn't have worried too much as the Master appeared within the first five minutes and the truth of their return was revealed at the end of the episode.

Obviously, as the title suggests, this is one of those stories which will need to be considered as a part of the whole to see if it works or not ultimately. However, as a set up I felt it was much more leisurely than some of the stories we have seen for a long time. It took its time (and was all the better for this choice)to move the plot along and concentrated on the things we wanted to see: Wilf's meeting with the Doctor again, the sad reflection over Donna and yet the joy that she hadn't changed that much, the emotional turmoil of the Doctor, the encounter with the Master and the realisation that the knocks weren't just a construct of his madness. Then there were the salutes to Silence of the Lambs and Being John Malkovitch which I enjoyed. And the ultimate reflection of the Master's God compex - a world made in his own image.

And finally the question of who or what is knocking. Did that look like one of the wirches at the end? Or, and I'm not sure if this is a good thing or not, we've heard the Rani's name bandied about over the last few years - is she finally back? And when they do come back, will they come back undamaged or changed by the experience?

For me, all the best bits of RTD and few of the irritating bits. Some great characterisation and lots of interesting questions raised. How exciting.

Oh and I'd be very surprised if Chase liked it.

I thought it was completely f'ing absurd, right down to The Master becoming a comic-book super villain.

I'll stop now before I say something I regret, because I'm ready to unleash a string of expletives about this story and how it makes "Love & Monsters" seem award-worthy.

Months and months of waiting... and we get this abomination. At least he didn't save the crap for part 2, as was the case with "Last of the Time Lords". Gods, even the reveal of the return of the Time Lords on Gallifrey made me cringe.

After being disappointed massively by 'WOM' it was with mixed feelings I sat down to watch this...what if it was as bad (or God forbid worse, if that's possible) than the aforementioned?

I needn't have worried...I'm not going to give any spoilers at all but must say that 'End of Time Pt 1' is brilliant and I can't wait until next week for Pt 2!!!

Narrating: what a stilted way to do things. Poor. Dalton has a way of talking that makes everything sound good and this prose needed him.  

 

Ood: Okay so now the Ood are spiritual mentors…or something. Was RTD setting this up as…oh, the Last Supper? Stilted and dull and silly and not relevant at all. Oh and look, another all encompassing disaster looming. Yawn.

 

Red eye: Okay so now what does the red eye mean? It meant something different in season 2 and in season 4 so now what does it mean? Do we find out? Is Sutek coming back? Soggoth? The Devil? A Dameon?

 

Master plan: eating: Lucy: jumping: stupid as hell. The Master eating the food: silly and demeaning to the old Master. He’s now like some super villain from SPIDERMAN or the DC Universe and DW has officially become a comic book but not one of the cool ones. Truly a disaster. “I’m hungry,”  indeed. Just really dumb. I suppose there makes some sense that there would be a Master cult somehow but how? How did Mrs. Refusis (is she a monoid from THE ARK?) and all the others remember Harold Saxon and keep his memory going? Or did they just remember something written down in a book by Harold? Either way: cliché and tired. Lucy fared well though didn’t she? She didn’t stop him at all and I guess that was due to Naismith.  Is Naismith supposed to be a slant against Obama? Or does RTD like Obama? Who knows? Who cares? The jumping thing: looks like a super villain again. Put him in SPIDERMAN 5. Wow, not that there’s anything wrong with super villains but they don’t really belong in DW in this manner do they? Even if they do, the entire thing is just poorly done. Totally poor and I’m not John Simm fan but this time it’s not his fault. It’s the fault of the designs, the writer, and the producer and director, who’s direction isn’t even that poor, no really.

 

Matrix: I got the warming feeling that this crap was playing out in the Matrix: that the Doc and the Master are already dead and playing their superhero fantasies out in the Matrix. How else can you explain that the Doctor just keeps walking into the Master’s fire…as the Master fires from his fingertips, again in super villain fashion. Just where are the X MEN?  The dope walks into the fire and gets hit and…then is just minorly hurt and wounded somehow…guess those bolts don’t really pose a threat at all, do they? Did the Doc have one heart stopped again? Did any of that mean anything? NOPE, then we get Nosmith’s men attacking and they just leave the Doctor there ….on the ground…helpless…did they not know who he was? If not, why leave him alive? If so, why leave him at all? And if so, how’d they know the Doctor? Does the writer really care at all about any of this? Do we now?      

 

Doctor Please let me help: Who the hell does he think he is? He can help the Master in that mess of a state he’s in? I guess it goes along with the much better WATERS OF MARS but really… they need to return the Doctor to a normal traveler in time and space, who has some fraility and commonality with us…not some GOD who can solve or thinks he can solve it all. Pathetic. Pathetic tone, pathetic “mythic” event. Just boring and stupid and reducing DW to drivel.  

 

Oh I’m going to die; Oh get over yourself Doctor. It’s not you. Oh boohoo. You get to keep your pretty young girls, your police box of marvels and live for over 1000 years or more and you’re crying because your beautiful hair will be gone. Get over yourself. “Some other guy will saunter off.”  NO< it’s THE Doctor. So what if he will look like a school boy or an old man. It’s still you! As you told Rose, you dolt.

 

Making due: A sad xmas message. Should’ve expected it from the British. Yah, we all make due. Donna’s doing just fine I say. Leave her the f alone or you’ll mess up her life. Too bad the next Doc can’t cure her. I think she and I would love that.   

 

Queen Vic?: Did WIlf and the Doc walk into the Queen Vic from the hopelessly glum EASTENDERS? Every time I watch Eastenders on Youtube, I’m entertained. Every time I watch it on TV on Channel 21 I find it boring, sad and depressive. I guess that is the show seasons ago or years ago?

 

Western Draw: powers: Doc and Master face each other and walk toward other. All that’s missing is the Doc saying, “Draw”  Having we seen that already with Mr. Finch. When is RTD leaving?

 

Wilf’s personal story: This is rather good. I don’t like the old people meeting the Doctor. What was the point of that? To get their nightmares cleared? Then on Wilf’s word, the old people treat the Doc like a celebrity and pinch his butt (that was funny but the rest…poor). It is as RTD wants to do the same thing. VOMIT inducing scene. Truly nightmarish and stupid.  SO Wilf was a paratrooper and was shot at in the war but he never killed anyone. What kind of soldier was he then? OH and his having to pick up a gun…not sure I like that tone.

 

Green spikey aliens: What for? Nothing added and nothing original.

 

Hey what happened? What happened to the Doc saving Luke from crossing the street?

 

Black man and woman: Oh…..kay. Another black man villain and another crazy female. Has Lucy come back from the dead?  

 

Master eating with hands: such a disrespect to Roger Delgado is what went through my mind. The Master, dignified to the end, would NEVER eat like this no matter what was going on inside him. Just not the Master at all. VOMIT inducing.

 

Why did Master wait? Did he have to wait to spring himself out of the jacket or his mind.

 

Master plan: become me: SHADA! The entire plan to have everyone become the Master is totally nicked from SHADA. I mean really stolen!

 

Saw that coming from a thousand miles away: Okay back in 2005 I predicted that the end of RTD’s leaving would show Gallifrey or Time Lords or both. It is SOOO BORING! And makes NO sense. I guess RTD will trump up some thing by way of explanation.

 

Donna’s memory: This is rather well done but really I would have wanted a better menace to come and resurrect her memories. Hope she doesn’t die.

 

 Almost totally wrong for Christmas (how is Obama going to help the UK?) and totally wrong for DW (but maybe okay for THE FLASH)…what strikes me is how BATMAN has become serious and real world minded (maybe too much so) with the newest movie and how DW has become more and more comic bookish (in a bad way) with this drivel. This is a sad farewell for a good Doctor…and thus far we’ve seen none of the guest stars we want to : Luke, Sarah, Capt Jerk, K9, Leela, Sarah, Romana, Martha, Mickey, Jackie (notice I’m NOT mentioning Rose).

 

Old Lady on tv and the Narrator: Anyone doubt that these are the Doc’s parents???? And who is that lady? She reminds me of the mother on the awful show THREE AND A HALF MEN.

 

All in all a 2/10. or a 1/5

Was this your first time watching Doctor Who? Did you actually see Water of Mars (personally I think it was very bad) Do you have any knowledge about the show at all? Or were you just bummed because all your theories were flushed down the toilet?

Granted the show was not worth the 10 months of hype, but come on, anyone who has seen at least the last series could tell you everything fit.

The Doctor snapped a bit in Water of Mars. Watch the last 15 minutes. The lady in the TV is not his mother, and Wilf is most likely not his father. Timothy Dalton is the Valiyard, and it is more concievable that Wilford Mott (tiMe lord Wtf) is actually the Doctor himself. However, dispite the similarities we see between the two, that is not likely.

The Master.......... I could explain a bit about what is going on with him, but I think it would just go over your head. Re-watch the first 15 minutes of Master footage, you may see what I mean.

Donna Noble, unless you missed it, and in case your Latin is rusty, is loosely Time Lord (Lady), or more basicly, Lady of Time. Hint, think past companion.

Oh well, I think I might have given you TMI. But if it helps, I have only seen these past 5 series in full, and bits and pieces of the past 47 years. I have a pretty good grap of what the show is, and what it isnt. All you have to do is pay attention. Provided you can afford to.

The Phoenix

Um a mixed bag of treats for me. When I sat down to watch it I didn't let anything distract me and just enjoyed it but when I sat back and looked at it more closely I was kind of dissapointed. There were a lot of things I liked where they started and then not so much. One of the first things that bugged me was right at the beginning, which isn't good. I don't have a problem with the Master's ressurection just the way they did. What was with the "potions of life" and "Books of Saxon" stuff, it was a ressurection more fitting for a fantasy setting than it was of a sci-fi setting esspecially one like Doctor Who. RTD has this thing with making things seem mystical when he doesn't need to.

I liked the idea of everyone in the universe having visions of the Master, that time was bleeding and they were getting glimpses of this horriable future, kind of reminded me of Childhood's End. I also liked the Master in the middle of this episode. I'm sorry but I have to disagree with Chase, I don't think the Master would be dignified to the end. Here he has absouletly nothing and is dying because his ressurection went wrong. Which brings me to another problem I had. The Master shooting bolts of electricty and jumping like a frog. Sure his life force is burning up but this only explains why he is weak and super-hungry not why he suddenly has superpowers.

Now to my favorite part of the episode. I really enjoyed Wilf and the Doctor in the Cafe. It's not often we get to see the Doctor reflect on his mortality. I think we have only seen two situations like this before in Planet of the Spiders and in The Caves of Androzani. I think it was a mistake to put in the line about regeneration feeling like death. While this may be true to some degree I think the Doctor really has felt like this may be his actual death.

There are other things I could complain or praise but I'm going to hold my judgment to after the conclusion. It's stories like these I wish we had the old story format because this feels rushed and I could see this being one of those 10-12 episode stories of the old days. Anyways that is all for now.

The deal with the Master and the electricity is simple. He is "broken". His body can not contain the energy that is part of the Lime Lords being. Rewatch the segment with him and the Doctor before the Master is abducted. Might explain away a bit of confusion, not much, after all, this was a cliffhanger episode.

Oh, one more thing, the Imortality gate seemed to have healed him.

The Phoenix

NOOOOOOO! Of this? Argh! I'm glad it's only two!

tarashnat's picture

Remember, Chase, that this Master is a copy made by the Timelords for the Time War, that then ran away and hid in the persona of Professor Yana and then died in the Doctor's hands. His resurrection ritual was interrupted by Lucy Saxon and it went wrong. The insane comic book villain is the end result.

I thought the dig on Obama was symmetrical to the dig on Bush in Last of the Timelords. Though both treatments may be a bit harsh, they are justified. And they provide some comic relief in what are pretty dark stories.

The Ood red eye signifies when they have become possessed. They are being "possessed" by the dreams.

As far as RTD mining and rehashing ideas from old Doctor Who, this is nothing new, and this complaint is becoming boring. This is RTD reusing the elements of Doctor Who that struck him most from his experience and now he is turning them up a notch.

Despite the reuse of certain elements, RTD is taking the Doctor on a journey. Being the last Timelord has gone to his head, and his hubris will now come home to roost. Of course, it was obvious that since the Daleks somehow survived the Time War, the Timelords somehow did as well. But i think that attacking this obvious conclusion is being disingenuous. For one, the character of the Doctor worked best as the rebel, the outcast from Timelord society. RTD has taken the Doctor to the place were he is now assuming the Timelords' role in the universe. He is now setting up the character to once again play off against his own people. I think that this can only add to the program going into the future, especially given the fact that Steve Moffat wasn't too fond of the portrayal of the Timelords.

Now we won't see until New Year's Day, if any of the plot issues are holes, or there for a reason. But I felt that this was quite a good setup for the finale. Whether the ball gets dropped or not, we shall see, but those arguments can't really be made until such time.

---
Have we done the crash of the Byzantium yet?

DWNY a New York City based Doctor Who meet up group.

"The insane comic book villain is the end result."

It's one thing to be insane - it's another for him to not just be insane, but BE a comic book supervillain complete with ridiculous superpowers. He's a Time Lord, not a Superman wannabe.

It's even worse than the Mecha-Godzilla stuff at the end of "The Next Doctor".

But what purpose did those powers serve? Nothing that couldn't have been achieved without the silliness.

"And they provide some comic relief in what are pretty dark stories."

Except it doesn't feel like comic relief. It felt like filler, an excuse to waste some time because RTD is pretty much incapable of providing explanations for his numerous plot holes. He's said it himself that he cares more about the end result than stuff making sense, and it shows to an extreme in this story.

You've got a group trying to resurrect Saxon/The Master. Resurrected Time Lords (and did they say that they actually *want* the end of time? have they gone batsh*t too?). This guy and his daughter who get their hands on stuff from Torchwood. And you have whomever is sending messages to Wilf.

That's just way too much going on, and *none of it* makes any sense in the least. And now everybody has been changed into The Master, which automatically necessitates the need for a  reset button? *sigh*

I can only hope Pt 2 is only half as terrible as Pt 1. Which is a complete shame, because the acting has otherwise been great (although that guy and his daughter just plain annoy me). It really is great to have Cribbins back, and Tennant is always fun to watch, even when the writing he has to work with is crap.

I must not be watching the same show as you. Who is "that guy and his daughter" And Who has "stuff from Torchwood"

I don't remember Torchwood even being mentioned. Wow perhaps I was watchins Smallville instead.

The Phoenix
daveac's picture

Haven't had the heart to post about this, this, this 'whatever it was'

Just this - it was awful.

I might be able to watch Part 2 - but only because of the last 10 seconds.

Cheers, daveac

 

odessasteps's picture

 

I'm actually heartened to see that a hardcore like Dave also didn't like it.

 

Second viewing did not improve my thoughts.

 

I also have some trepidations after seeing the spoiler of part two that's on youtube involving Timothy Dalton.

(BTW, do we know who is he yet? Is he Rassillon or Borussa or anyone we know?)

romana_II's picture

Am I the only one that liked it?

Am I stupid for liking it? :(

Like, yet unlike Dave, I haven't the heart to post my throughts now after reading so much hate being leveled at an episode I really enjoyed.

It almost makes me want to cry.

Sometimes I don't think you guys will ever be happy with any Doctor Who you get, because you always seem to rip into it and always seem to hate it.

Can't you be content to just watch and enjoy it? Remember, the show isn't just for you guys anymore, and that there is a large amount of people out there who enjoyed it.

Sure it has some unanswered questions, sure it has plot holes (what episode of Doctor Who doesn't!) but that is because it is PART 1 OR 2 PARTER!

Watch it next week and give the bloody thing a chance.

And if you don't like new Doctor Who, simply don't watch it! Stop making yourselves and others suffer through your fan angst.

 

*storms off to weep*

~Hysterical Woman #1088~
The Wailing Fangirl Podcast

"Can't you be content to just watch and enjoy it?"

Fine, I'l be the mean one: Can't you let us voice our opinions without criticizing us for it? Just about every time we say we don't like an episode, you're on the attack.

It's simple, really: RTD has his ups and downs as a writer. For every enjoyable episode, we get a clunker. I loved "The Next Doctor" until the giant Cyberthingy showed up. I enjoyed "Planet of the Dead" and "The Waters of Mars" throughout.

I don't want to hate any episode of Doctor Who; I don't want to hate the writing. But if the writing is bad, I'm going to say so. DEAL WITH IT.

So, here's a thought: don't like what we have to say? Don't read it.

It sounds like you're the one with the problem here in taking everything so personally.

Perhaps it just takes a non-liniar mind to understand that things dont always have simple answers, or maybe it is that some people just dont pay attention.

Thanks for understanding the meaning of "wibbly wobbly, timey wimey"

The Phoenix
daveac's picture

'hate?'

I was upset - not hate.

I just thought RTD and made up a convoluted silly storyline with a 'super-powered Master' just for one line only - so he could play with the pun 'The Master Race'

Not hate, but it was for me about the worst Doctor Who - 201 on the Wizard list.

Cheers, daveac

romana_II's picture

My post wasn't a dig at you Dave, but at alot of different people I've seen on the internet over the last couple of days.

But having said that, it certainly sounds like you hate it to me (or at least strongly dislike it), you wouldn't want to put it at number 201 if you didn't.

Like you I'm upset, but for a different reason, that people hate this episode, and are saying things about it I just can't see, calling things horrible that I loved, and sometimes it makes me feel like I'm a bad person for liking it, and I don't like feeling that way.

I feel like sometimes, some fans, (and I'm not referring to you at all here Dave) are insulting my intelligence and love of this show just because I enjoy it. I don't like being bitter about a show I love, yet it seems that I'm the only person left in fandom that will enjoy any Doctor Who no matter what.

I think it largely comes from the fact that I love Simm Master, I loved Last of the Timelords, I love the Doctor and the Master together, and I only really really really got into Doctor Who at the end of series 3 (before then I was a fan, but no where near as much as a fan as I am now) most people (at least here) seem to hate everything I love... and that upsets me sometimes, I try to keep it to myself most of the time, but for some reason, I just can't do it tonight.

So, I'm going to try my hardest to defend this story on every podcast I go on in the next week, because I liked it, (I wouldn't go as far as saying it's my favourite episode of Doctor Who ever, but it could be a contender for the top 10) and I also feel bad for all the hard work everyone put into making this story. I just only pray I'm not lynched for liking this story, surely we can discuss this without fighting.

Then again, I might be overreacting, it might be my hormones, lack of sleep, or my regeneration angst starting to kick in, but I think I should just step away for tonight, try to sleep, before I get to emo about it.

~Hysterical Woman #1088~
The Wailing Fangirl Podcast

David Hooie's picture

Okay,  as a comic book "nut" and yes, a Superman fan (you should SEE my home office!)  I wanted to weigh in with my own thoughts on the abilities we're seeing the Master exhibit.

Maybe I misconstrued what the Doctor was saying to him, I thought the line about the Master's life force being burned up, meant that his use of these "extra abilities" is what was causing his life force to be burned up to quickly.  (Sort of like running on pure adrenaline all the time).  I believe the resurrection made him completely insane and definitely went wrong, but I didn't walk away thinking THAT was how he got the abilities he's using.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I could almost accept the leaping and the lightning, although The Doctor walking right into it is just plain stupid unless a small part of him is feeling suicidal because he knows his time is up.

I personally didn't LOVE part 1, but I'm with Romana II, I'm holding all my judgement until part 2 is over and I can make a fair opinion based on the whole story.  The one part I didn't like was the Doctor's comment about "someone else walking away" after he regenerates.  I agree with the previous poster who reminded us that it was HIM who said, "I changed, every cell in my body, but it's still ME".  Come on Doctor!  Get over yourself!

Checkout my podcast, Hoo On Who at http://www.hooonwho.com
romana_II's picture

I believe in what I heard in the commentary, that the Master is almost like a dying star, all the energy bursting out like a Supernova.

Each time he uses any one of his various powers, he's that one step closer to death, like his life force is exploding out of him.

That's what I think anyway.

I'm finding it interesting however, looking at the Tardis Groans poll of this, 39% - 5, 22% - 4, 35% - 3, 4% - 2. Seems like there are still some people who like it enough to give it a 3-5. I don't feel too upset now... I guess.

~Hysterical Woman #1088~
The Wailing Fangirl Podcast

President Nice's picture

"The one part I didn't like was the Doctor's comment about "someone else walking away" after he regenerates.  I agree with the previous poster who reminded us that it was HIM who said, "I changed, every cell in my body, but it's still ME"."

But you must bear in mind that is wasn't the Doctor that was about to regenerate that said that. Perhaps the Ninth Doctor did feel exactly that way. Personally I thought the episode was absolutely terrible up until that scene with Wilf in the cafe and then it caught me. Everything before that felt like a whole 45 minute episode cut down into 30 minutes or however long it was. It chopped and changed from scene to scene like nothing else I've ever scene in Doctor Who. It explained nothing and did it in a very confusing way. I felt like RTD had watched too much Heroes.

However the thing that I disliked the most was the pointless SFX of the Master's skull showing when he laughed maniacally. Why? It would have worked so much better without it. It was a case of Show Don't Tell imo which up until now RTD has been very good at avoiding.

I am still looking forward to part 2 however as I feel sure it will all pull together.

 

It had a few bits I didn't like (the Master's resurrection, lots of running around shipyards, random green spiky-headed aliens, weirdly incestuous father and daughter), but those were eclipsed by the many things I did like (Donna getting her memory back, Donna's mom shouting at the air, the Doctor's chats with Wilf and the Master, John Simm's totally over the top bat-poop crazy insane portrayal of the Master, and the big reveal at the end).

 

3.5/5, and can't wait for the finale.

odessasteps's picture

 

If we didn't like the episode, are we not supposed to express ourselves?

I know that this corner of the Who-niverse tends to skew positive, but surely there's room for criticism when warranted.

I've never been a fan of the "if you don't like, don't watch" argument, as it implies we should just be grateful for anything served up with a show's name on it.

Personally speaking, I've grown weary of seeing many of the same elements over time in RTD stories and will be glad to see a new person in charge. that doesn't mean RTD's contribution to the show (starting with getting it brought back) should be ignored.

Isn't having a new showrunner part of the greatness of the show, on a par with the new actor playing the Doctor? While being a fan of the Letts and Holmes eras, I can still find things about some of those shows I didn't like. And, eventually, good as they were, it was time for someone new to change things up.

My biggest regret about these "lame duck specials" is Tennant isn't going out with a stronger story. Tennant and Simm and Cribbins were all great in part one and I expect them (as well as Dalton) to be good in the second part.

I just hope that we don't see the same Deus Ex Machina ending we seemingly have seen now in almost all of the season finales.

romana_II's picture

I'm fine with opinion, sure you can express yourselves, but it still upsets me that a lot of people can't seem to find anything postive to say at all (they can't surely hate everything), and usually express their opinions in negative, non constructive ways that often hurts us who do like things and makes it sound like they hate everything.

I understand the arguement that most people have against RTD, and I'm also looking forward to Moffat, but I myself don't let myself get worked up any of them (mostly) because I'm realistic, what can I do stop it.

And the whole, 'don't like it don't watch it' I think I direct at the fans who seem to be making themselves suffer so so much, and hate it so much, that for them, the best thing for them is to stop watching.

You cannot make the episode different, so if you hate it so much, don't watch it, because RTD simply doesn't listen to the fans, that much is known (for the record, I haven't loved 'everything' he has done in the past either (ie: Torchwood) I'm just not as negative about it.)

Express fine, just remember that some of us out do enjoy it, comment, crititise, but try to keep the insults less maybe....  intense

~Hysterical Woman #1088~
The Wailing Fangirl Podcast

Of course he does. If you read  his book, you will find that he does care about the fans and their opinions and the other viewers as well. He's actually admitted in his book that writing his last few things before the end of season 4 was a huge chore, mostly because he was sick but torture he went through writing JOURNEY'S END and the one before that made me realize how hard his job is and...how NO one person should have tried to handle all that he did but he did it and it came out...really bad. I feel the same things happened with NEXT DOCTOR, LAST OF THE TIME LORDS and possibly this crap. Ithink the man is burned out of DW and doesn't have an idea in his head left for it and does not have the real passion one needs for this shows. He burned out of that at the end of season 3 with a few bright spurts cming on later (MIDNIGHT, PLANET OF THE DEAD---possibly, and a few others) from him. Now I loved season four but not those last two eps and I think he's contributed great stuff all along and all over the map for DW but he's been doing it far far too long and yes, he's getting ratings so judged on that, ALL of it just works for the public if not for the fans but it seems to be working for the fans. It just doesn't always work for me. I can't just blindly like everything that has the DW label on it, not after an almost perfect two or three seasons and a mostly terrific season four (bar LAST OF THE TL for season 3). But he's really now a one note writer: BIG EARTHLY SHATTERING THINGS with rip offs from movies (For Gallifrey! IS like FOr Sparta). He hasn't one original idea left in his head for DW and his stories feel like leftovers or worse, second strings to his earlier stories and seasons. Nothing feels...well, like it feels anything. It just is. With almost everything from ROSE to DOOMSDAY and even to LOVE AND MONSTERS and FEAR HER and the stuff with Martha and HUMAN NATURE, I cared. I felt something for these characters and worried they might die.  While there is some of that with WIlf and DOnna, ther'es not much. I was wide eyed when the Daleks and the CYbermen battled with Jackie, Mickey, Jake, Rose and her dad, all possibly down for the chop. I was amazed at the Doc's solution. Totally amazed. I loved the tear jerker of HUMAN NATURE and was stunned by the "horror" of BLINK and MIDNIGHT. They all meant something, did something. But a majority of RTD's stuff just is hollow and this story is at the heart of that. The epitome of that hollowness is LAST OF THE TIME LORDS so it is not a surprise that this Master story didn't realy come off. It almost did. It is not as bad as LAST and to be fair, this time John Simm is not to blame. Last time he was. I still think he's a terrible choice for the Master and NOTHING they've (the NEW SHOW) done with the Master has any charm, any menace, any care behind it at all. It's just sensationalistic garbage with stilted dialog designed to make one go "OHHHHHHHH!" Or "DID He just say that>" Unforutnately yeah he did. And from what i've heard of Moffat's dialog, things may not improve. And the Doc may still be this superhero and not the Doctor, the alien who is a bit like us, a bit like human beings, who can relate to us.

Another problem is that: the Doc needs a companion for more than one season, even more than two seasons. Tennant's Doctor is just a lone, such a dope sometimes, so conceited, and so NOT fun sometimes that he need someone with him. SOmeone who wants to be there or someone who is forced to be with him. For a longer time than we've seen on the new show. HAVing stuffed shirts and stupid drama queens like Adalaide (did she really have to kill herself?) and then Wilf, and then Donna and then this one and that one, doesn't help the show at all. The Doctor is NOT the show, despite what RTD thinks. The show is the DOctor and his companion, no matter how cliche that  companion might be (I prfer they not be cliche but most people do).   RTD is in love with the Doctor too much and in love with the angsty, lonely Doctor too much. That sucks the fun out of it all. And going to that well (Yes, it has a place someplace in the DW lore and that's fine but leave it at some point) too often has diluted the Doctor, made him too self referential and self absorbed. I almost want him to leave Donna alone, let her live her life. I shouldn't want that from the writing. ANd it is the writing. I should want Donna to fly into his arms or his TARDIS and laugh and want to travel again and have him happy for that feeling. Instead we get him staing away from her and her not traveling yet. ANd yes, it all makes sense to what has gone before but it's not fun, it's just sad and dark and we've seen it all before really. It's a downer and who wants that out of DW?       

Mr. Magister's picture

What is it w/ RTD and the 'super rich GQ bad guy' character that seem to crop up every so often - what bad acting!!  WHew.

Also, the green aliens seemed almost purposely comical.  They didn't say anything comical, but their realization made me awaiting something in the Jar-Jar realm of embarrassment.

Mr. Magister

Mr Smith's picture

That's what I feel like when I read the comments on here about TEOT pt 1.

Was I the only one who enjoyed it ? Yes that's right enjoyed it. Yes it wasn't perfect. Yes there where to many Superman & Harry Potter rip offs, but it was fun. Big, dumb, exciting fun. And after all isn't that what Dr Who is supposed to be ?

The worst episode ever Dave AC ? what worse than boring snoozy episodes like Black Orchid, worse than Time & the Rani ? really ? come on. You didn't enjoy Sir Bernad Cribbins wonderful performance or the lovely June Whitfield cameo ? You are a hard man to please.

I for one cant wait for new years day.

romana_II's picture

Yay, someone else who enjoyed it.... I was beginning to feel a little lonely in the 'I liked it' camp.

Welcome ^_^

~Hysterical Woman #1088~
The Wailing Fangirl Podcast

ok people just maybe being that time lords travel to many different planets with many different gravity s maybe they are able to adapt and change how gravity affects them the doctor was walking on mars just like normal and we all know mars is different then earth gravity wise so maybe the master just changed his internal gravity and jumped like he would on a planet that has a heavier gravity.and when a time lord regenerates energy shoots out his head and arms well maybe the master is using this energy as a offensive weapon also the doctor has funneled off his unused regenerative energy into his hand, and sent the mass of radiation in his body into his shoe whos to say he couldnt shoot it out his hand if he felt so inclined.also whos to say that we know everything that the time lords are capible of we only know what the creators let us know so just maybe its something we havent been privy to before?

tarashnat's picture

The Master's energy is the post "regeneration"/resurrection/artron energy that is spilling out from the failed resurrection which had Lucy's spanner thrown into it's works. We've seen the Doctor regrow a hand using the energy, so why can't a "torn open" Master not have the energy bleeding out of him. The Doctor channeled his regeneration energy into a hand in a jar, so with the strong will of the Master, I would expect him to at least be able to channel the direction of the energy. There is nothing new here, we have seen this all before. It is just on a larger scale. It is obvious that the Master doesn't have full control, as he misses the Doctor twice, before finally striking him in the chest. And all it does to the Doctor is temporarily overwhelm him, as this is Timelord energy anyway.

 

 

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Have we done the crash of the Byzantium yet?

DWNY a New York City based Doctor Who meet up group.

It seemed to me they were there to supply information. Remember, they're the ones who tell the doctor and wilf what that gate-thingy was. also, is it just me or did that guy who donna was engaged to look a bit like mickey? (i'm thinking it was the hair cut and the shape of his face, but still.)
Sorry about that. Posting from a cell phone in the middle of nowhere.
tarashnat's picture

I removed the duplicates.

 

Taras

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Have we done the crash of the Byzantium yet?

DWNY a New York City based Doctor Who meet up group.

it was crap!

Idiom's picture

No, it wasn't.

There you go - that argument is as good as yours!

I'm going to wait for part 2 and go into detail on the finale as a whole.  Giving a full in-depth reaction to this would just not be pretty.  But that won't stop me from giving a few quick thoughts.

- Don't really care for The Master and the new powers.  Regeneration/resurrection side-effect or not, it's silly any way you look at it.  The Master's power (like The Doctor) has always been his sharp mind and the beauty of their encounters has been the battle of wits.  One-upping The Doctor with these powers waters down The Master character and their encounters.  imho.

- The Master taking over/enslaving humanity.  Been there, done that.  As was hinted in the story, The Master may just be a pawn in the grand scheme of the Time Lords, but so far it looks like recycled plot.

- And barring some sort of scripting genius, it does appear some sort of global reset is coming.  However I wonder since the Time Lords are involved, if it will not be some sort of "universal" reset, perhaps altering the outcome of the Time War and picking up immediately thereafter, allowing their return?  It was the Time Lords that brought The Master back, so would it not also make sense that they used him and made preparations for a "plan B" in case the Time War didn't end as they'd hoped?

- At The Master's resurrection ceremony, it sounded to me like one woman referred to another as "Mrs. Trefusis".  I wonder if this is some reference to a similarly named character mentioned in "The Stones of Blood", or just a coincidence?

- On a positive note, I will say that I'm glad the Time Lords appear to be headed back...hopefully in a permanent capacity.  I think the ideas and concept of "the lonely traveller" and "last of my race" has run its course and it's time for new storylines to emerge.

Were a regeneration not known to be coming, this would appear to be heading towards the bottom of the barrel of season finales since the revival...worse than Last of the Time Lords, if that's possible.

Doctor Whoovie's picture

Well my feeling about the story is very neutral, I didn't love it, I didn't hate it.

The good
----------

  • * Lucy Saxon in her finest 'Ellen Ripley' look-a-like outfit
  • * The fact that it wasn't Lucy who had rescued the Master, and she was still against him.
  • * Bernard Cribbens
  • * June Whitfield in bum pinching mode
  • * The Master/skelet(on/or) effect - Kind of 'Deadly Assassin' in a modern hi-tech way
  • * Nina from 'Being Human' (Sinead Keenan) though she changes into a spiney puffafish and not a werewolf. 

The Bad
----------

  • * RTD deciding he has to out climax, all his other over the top finales (for my money, Doomsday was the only one that worked)
  • * The Stargate (I'm with Ken on the topic of SG)
  • * Neo The Master doing his superman thing
  • * The Ood with red eyes (that means deranged - or conjuntivitis - or something like that) as a sign of something ominous
  • * Bringing back the Time Lords. Once they are back, the whole of the 9th and 10th doctor episodes will seem pretty pathetic in retrospect. Is RTD just trying to trash his legacy?
  • * Everyone becoming the Master - Except Wilf and Donna - This necessitates a "Reset Switch" ending. Despite RTDs protests in DW Confidential, I am sure Donna will be written into the solution in Part 2. If you can bring back a cremated Master, resurrect the Time Lords, allowing Donna not to die if she sees the Doctor is easy (or the easy way out).

Let's hope this is a "Doomsday" kind of story where part 2, completely eclipses the first episode and not a "Journey's End" or a "Last of the Time Lords" where the conclusion was a rather pathetic finish to an excellent start (not that we've really had that start).

Barring a fantastic episode next week, I find myself wishing that the Doctor had regenerated at the endof  'The stolen Earth" and we were waiting for Matt without the four not so specials (and Journey's End).

 

 

 

Dalzo's picture

So, from what we've seen so far RTD is going out with a bang... A bang of controversy that is!

I am not too sure about this episode. It feels like it could (and should) have been much better. It just seemed a bit of a mess and doesn't seem to hold together too well although whether this will be true after the second episode remains to be seen. I loved the Wilf/Doctor scene in the cafe. This was beautifully written and acted and I have no problem with the Doctor saying that he didn't like the prospect of another "him" walking away from his "death". This seems totally consistant with what has gone before. Sure, he said that he is the same man but he did say this right at the beginning of his regeneration when he was trying to convince Rose to stay with him. The fact that whenever he meets himself his various personas don't tend to get along shows that although they are the same man it doesn't mean they are the same person... Their characters are different so the person who is the tenth Doctor will die and a new person will take his place. Seems like a legitimate fear to me!

The Masters Resurrection, although well done, seemed more like a Dennis Wheatly novel. Black magic. As will be a theme in this post it just did not feel like Doctor Who to me. I would have much preferred a more scientific method of his return but I suppose you could argue a la Daemons style that it was just science that we are yet to understand.

That said,I loved The Master in this so much more than in his last appearance. Before, he seemed to be doing an opposite immitation to The Doctor but in this he seems genuinely mad and extremely dangerous. His eating was a highlight for me, frightening and well edited and acted! To say that this is demeaning to the old Master is totally ridiculous and absurd. This Master has lived a lot longer (and died a couple more times) and has had many more life changing experiences. He is a down and out at this point and is burning away so needs the sustenance. Why is this demeaning? It is character progression and he is doing what is needed to survive!! You can't expect writers to dismiss a story idea just because it might go against the character as he was 20 years ago!!!

All that said, I too have issues with the "flying Master". Funnily enough, I have no problems with the way it fits in the story or even how it is explained but it just felt wrong... Not Doctor Who! This is also the case with The Master shooting his electric bolts out of his hands. Why he misses twice is beyond me and why The Doctor lets himself get hit is also a bit of a mystery and makes no sense to me.

The ending also disturbed me. Put aside the green aliens who just seemed to be an attempt  at comic relief (although maybe they will play a pivotal role in the second part) I had a frightening moment when I thought a Dalek was going to come out of that archway... That would have been BAD! The whole Master becoming the entire human race also did not sit well with me. Once again, it just did not feel like Doctor Who... It felt wrong! This is also something I can't explain why it irritated me. Maybe it is the comic book feel but my heart kind of sank when I saw this.

The Timelords return is exciting and was done relatively well. The narration seemed out of place until we saw Dalton's face. When it became clear that he was talking to his fellow Timelords it seemed justified and on second viewing I actually quite liked it. That said, I watched this episode a second time with my Dad and his Girlfriend who are not huge Doctor Who fans and I sat there being slightly disappointed (as the niggles I have with it grew on my second viewing) whereas they really enjoyed it and said that it was by far the best Christmas adventure.

This brings me onto my final point about the manner of which some people review these episodes and (unfortunately) it is one I have made many times before. The sheer aggression and anxst people seem to have just because an episode hasn't lived up to the hopes and expectations is quite extraordinary. I know we are all passionate about this programme (I have lived with Doctor Who all my life and consider it my favourite programme of all time... and I am a fan of a lot of programmes) but I think it is totally unnecessary to be quite so angry. I know people are expressing their views but to set themselves up as some kind of Doctor Who za who forces their negativity with such brute force tells me that those people have lost all perspective. The fact that people who read these posts are getting upset  would, to me, be a good reason to tone down their future posts, for curtesy's sake if nothing else. Express opinion, say what you don't like but do it in a less aggressive and emotional way... People like Romana II, my Dad and his girlfriend and many others loved this episode, show some respect for that instead of saying "It was Crap" which is not a opinion but an attempt at a point of fact! Viewing television is a subjective matter and just because one person may not like it doesn't mean that nobody does.

As for those people not watching since it upsets them so much. I can understand why they don't at this point but I would say that if they are still so angry and upset that it is ruining their lives (which is genuinely the impression one gets when reading their posts) after a season with Matt Smith and Steven Moffat then they should stop watching until the next showrunner as they will have to accept that Doctor Who is no longer what they want it to be and let the rest of us (hopefully) enjoy it!!!

So, to sum up my views on the first part of this adventure. A good episode with some great moments as well as some disappointing ones. Hopefully, the second part will be as great as this episode should have been.

Have to agree with Romana II to some extent, some of the sheer vitriol that goes on around the internet against RTD and this episode in particular seems a bit over the top IMO.  This is not just a Doctor Who thing of course - it happens with almost any subject you can think of about which people feel strongly.  It can be a bit of a downer to see such sheer negativity about things, but on the other hand everyone is entitled to their own opinion, and if someone doesn't like something, then they don't like it.  It would be nice however if people could remember that these things (TV shows, movies, video games etc) are made by actual real people - who in some cases might read some of these posts - and as such I think a better job could be done by a lot of commenters about posting constructive criticisms about things they liked or didnt like, instead of the slating which sometimes goes on.  Having said that, I wouldnt class any of the posts in this particular forum as over the top though - they are just stating opinions, in most cases pretty eloquently.

Anyway, rant over.  As to the episode - it was a mixed bag, but in general I enjoyed it.  It was a bit slow at times - I thought the Doctor tracking down the master was a bit drawn out for example.  In terms of "action" not much really happens until the end - but on the other hand we get wonderful character moments like the bit with Wilf and the Doctor in the coffee shop.  Could definitely have done with a LOT more of that, and those are the things RTD does best, IMO.  The lines from the Doctor about regeneration actually got me.  While it's true, the Doctor has said before that regeneration is still him, I think the Tenth Doctor is at a point where he desperately loves the thing which IS the Tenth Doctor - that personality and appearance, and he does not want to lose that sense of self.  Maybe that does not bother other Doctors as much, but for the Tenth Doctor that's just part of his personality - he loves the Tenth Doctor - so much so that he averted a regeneration (Journey's End) to STAY the Tenth Doctor.  (Actually I think that makes him the Tenth AND Eleventh Doctor - or at least he has used 10 regenerations and not 9).

Also, it was pretty obvious from spoilers previous that Timothy Dalton was a Time Lord, but still, seeing them all revealed at the end was pretty breathtaking.  That scene definitely reminded me of the Galactic Senate in the Star Wars prequels though :-)

The master's "superpowers" didnt bother me - I think one of the posters above pointed out about the regeneration energy - and you know what, that's enough for me.  The green spiky aliens were a bit superfluous, but not offensive, and yes it took me a while to recognise the woman before I twigged it was from Being Human!

I did not like the "master race" thing though.  I thought it was just cheesy, and looked silly.  I think it would have worked MUCH MUCH better had the Master just imprinted his mind upon all of humanity.  Having characters and actors we know all ACTING like the master would have been much more effective, and even downright creepy in my opinion.

Having said that, I understand why RTD went for the "complete body replace" option - for the visual impact.  I bet, especially for children, it worked well this way.  I know we all like to claim DW as our own, but let's not forget it is largely, if not primarily, a kid's show, even though we kid ourselves it's not.

The other thing that was a bit dumb was the "book of saxon" thing.  Maybe that will be explained next week, or else we are just supposed to think that it was a backup plan the Master left behind.

I totally buy that there are cultists who followed Saxon - there are nut jobs everywhere after all.  For those who say "nobody is supposed to remember him" - no that's NOT correct.  The only thing people are not supposed to remember is the year which started AFTER he killed the president.  Everything up until then - his rise to power, revealing the Toclafane, even killing the president - all those things humanity should still remember.

Anyway, I'm definitely looking forward to Friday.  I've heard some hints that we may NOT see the regeneration in Part 2 - that will be very disappointing if so, unless it's done in some very clever way.

I'd probably give this episode 3.5/5 - of the 4 specials so far I'd put it just below Waters of Mars, but above Next Doctor and WAAAAAY above Planet of the Dead.

<<<dangers of travelling alone harkens way back to the genuinely dark William Hartnell days of 'An Unearthly Child.' For a short time, Hartnell would torture his companions and leave people to die. It's a fitting testament that both Tennant and Russell T Davies can evoke a new spin on concepts and ideas more than 40 years old.>>>>>>>

IF that was their plan and I doubt that it was...they did so badly. The First Doctor never left anyone to die but wanted to and I cna't remember him torturing his companions in any normal venue, and here, the 10th Doctor is doing any of that in what that is relevant? A new spin on what exactly?

Oh and just what happened to the "DARK" Doctor from WATERS OF MARS? Did he learn the error of his ways already? He's a loon again in the start of this and on top of that a crying mess who doesn't want to "die". After staggeringly bad stuff edging him up to be Godlike and that he "can't" die or that if he does die he will come back, NOW RTD plays up the fact that he CAN die. It's as if it's like OPPS guys I forgot this bit from the classic series just because you won't like that much because he's not like a super hero after all so just before I leave, I'll leave you with the idea that the next Doctor, the REAL Next Doctor, will just be sorta average compared to the 10th, MY Doctor. Thanks, bye,RTD. Oh and I thought that Moffat might be writing some of this ? DID HE? Or is he writing next week's

Frankly I would have thought that the Master, having failed SOO Many times, might have tried to settle down and THAT idea is much scarier than any world taking over idea. IMagine if you will a Master who wants to try to find  a family...a darker smaller story where he's actually like a stalker or a serial killer without actually killing anyone...yet. There's so much more menace in that kind of a storyline...but it would require doing something different with DOCTOR WHO, something  smaller scale with atmosphere. THIS as it was had NO atmosphere, no tone, and nothing to draw me to watch it a second time so that I can feel something for it. It IMO was garbage. I can't imagine any kids in the US liking this AT ALL.   <Maybe in other countries they will but and the ratings show that it is popular or was popular. But I hated it really. I mean as my review states it's not the worst DW story and it had some good parts but for character it lacked: the Doctor is whining, then tells Wilf not to dare die, Donna is there, the Master is over the top villainy and this time I can't blame John, he did what he could with a poor script, poor plot and poor scenes, direction and execution. It is all cliche and if that old lady is Rose I could just scream. I hate how her return was "handled" in the last story she was in. I'd gather it might be the Doc's mum and Dalton the Doc himself or the Doc's dad. Either way my hopes for the next part are are low as they can go so maybe I'll like it but I doubt it. How can I with the starting point that awful scene of the Master becoming everyone (ripped off from SHADA and not in the great way SHADA started to do it). Think about that scene for a moment. If your eyes don't grow wide in a semi panic for this show, you have better coping skills than I.  

Wyldstaar's picture

The thing with The Master is, whatever he's doing, it's gotta be big.  He just can't seem to wrap his brain around the concept of subtlety.  If he were really clever, he'd abandon all these grand schemes of building an empire on Earth.  The Earth is far too difficult a target to conquer.  Humans are difficult to control, and will kill you at the first opportunity.  It would be far more reasonable to find some backwater planet where nothing ever happens and conquer them instead.  The Master could build his powerbase there, and nobody would notice.  Yes, it's a quite likely that the Tardis would notice his presence in the timestream and bring The Doctor there eventually.  Still, it far more likely to succeed than the usual plans.

Enter: The Conquering Chicken

There's a reason he does what he does: that's to get the Doctor's attention really IMO. He has to be noticed and has to be there in person doing whatever to get the DOc to take notice of him. I wouldn't be surprised if the DOc were his father and the Master has to prove himself to his dad ala Bush and Bush. In all honesty if he were even a bit smart, he would stop trying to conquer anything or anyone and start trying to live a life like his hero: the Doctor. Then he' might really be scary!  

 

 

 

CRUSADE IN JEANS is a perfect example of using history and timetravel and good storytelling without contrived superheroics (you know what I mean). I just finished watching it and it is sooo good it stays with you.

1212 : the Children's Crusade has to be one of the saddest, stupidest events in history. 1000s of children and teens taking off to Jerusalem, going the wrong way, following a shepard boy who meant well but who either was duped into or deluded about having heard from God. The faithfull were used by the faithless adults. It all ends badly for the kids, either dying from starvation, the cold, or being sold into slavery by the adults they trusted (priests!!!!) or killed by animals. Many were lost and never saw their homes again, some survived. Some returned home. It's a little known facet of history and I'm shocked that no one has put it on the screen before this.

Mix in a 15 year old from Holland (the movie is made in Holland I think) who's mom works at a time travel research facility. They have not had success with the monkies they are using but (and I Missed the first 8 minutes or so) the boy Dolph, a swimmer, goes back in time. He had to be at a spot to get home and somehow in a storm misses it. He also had to have pills to keep him alive and he has about 80 but not enough until he can be picked up...and probes are being sent. To add to the urgency (See RTD there can be some urgency in time travel stuff), the kid's mum is "put on administrative duties" or fired. She has to sneak in to the place to try to get her son back.

There are all sorts of ways time is twisted here but none of them very Earth shattering but cool anyway. A monk the trip is drawing pictures of Dolph's experiences and how he helps the children survive. Many things he does do helps; some things are mistakes or accidents. Like all kids he hesitates and some of the kids die thanks to this. Make no mistake MAJOR characters die here and it's pretty heart breaking. Others are seriously hurt. And the hero makes mistakes and isn't all powerful. THAT IS WHAT DRAMA IS ALL ABOUT.

In any case, the ins and outs of this well filmed, well made, well acted, well scripted, well scored movie are just...FANTASTIC. This is not to be missed. I just love it. I wish there was as sequel or a series. The fantastic location shooting adds to this movie and it seems to have been shot in five different countries. A bittersweet, tense, warm, human movie!       

doogie448's picture

I'm usually pretty forgiving when it comes to sci-fi. I mean c'mon that's part of the set up is taking it one step beyond believable.

But in this case I sat and cringed as I watched this episode. The only other episode that came close to me doing that was Love and Monsters and I was confused by that.

Supercharged Master? Sorry Russell I can't give you that without a better explination. You show me how he got all Iron Man without the suit and I'll probably let it go. Cactus people, wooden temporary bad guy, deperate attempt to make viewers cry? I can overlook it. Taking a humanoid with no superpowers and dropping them on us, no. Take away his superpower, his brilliant mind. Or, leave him his mind and render his body useless Davros style. Bringing him back from the dead new and improved? Didn't work for New Coke and didn't work for New Master.

Actually, I would have probably cut everything from the diner scene to last couple of minutes and done a 90 minute episode instead. No, it wasn't rushed. It was too drawn out. Too much time to let RTD wander all over the place. 90 minutes, show me the Master, Bring on the Timelords, do a little regenerating and get on with it. My boss would have told me my story needs to be tighter if I wrote this, and he would be right.

tarashnat's picture

You show me how he got all Iron Man without the suit and I'll probably let it go. 

RTD did show how the Master ended up like he did—his "resurrection" was interfered with by Lucy Saxon. Whatever her patrons came up with to counteract the "potions of life" caused it to all go wrong and the Master is now "ripped open". It is only his will to survive that is keeping him together.

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Have we done the crash of the Byzantium yet?

DWNY a New York City based Doctor Who meet up group.

Just a quick little thought that woke me up the other morning

Professor Yana...You Are Not Alone

Wilfred Mott...Master Of Time Travel?

I loved TEOT Pt1 a zillion times more than WOM (which I thought was absolute rubbish, but each to their own) and can't wait for Pt2. And neither can my wife!

DarthSkeptical's picture

Seems like all of fandom is bothered by Lucy's kiss reanimating the Master.  "His DNA couldn't possibly still be on her lips, so that scene sucks", they say.  Well, I say they haven't listened to the scene.  The script never uses the word "genetics", but rather describes her as providing the "final biometrical signature".  Biometrics is the science of using quantifiable characteristics to identify individuals.  DNA is only one of those qualities.  Others include fingerprints, retina patterns, and body odor, just for a start.  I don't think it's out of the realm of science whatsoever to imagine that what the process was looking for was her lip print.  Or even her own personal DNA.  Of course it's not looking for the Master's DNA.  She was the key, not the carrier.

Have a lemon sherbet. It'll quench your thirst.

doogie448's picture

RTD did show how the Master ended up like he did—his "resurrection" was interfered with by Lucy Saxon. Whatever her patrons came up with to counteract the "potions of life" caused it to all go wrong and the Master is now "ripped open". It is only his will to survive that is keeping him together.

Sorry Taras but no.

That's how you inferred to have happened, which may be what RTD was after, but I didn't come away from it that way. In my mind when you screw around with something like that the subject should have come out weaker, not stronger. He was bleeding lifeforce. He should have been getting physically weaker every second until he stepped into the medical stargate. Instead he's leaping tall buildings in a single fireball and ripping out of straightjackets. Doesn't sound like somebody hermorraging lifeforce to me.

Poor me who doesn't get BBC America hasn't even had a chance to see this episode yet, and you guys are making it sound so horrible I'm almost afraid to watch! 

I've seen the trailers and a few clips and I think that David has once again put his whole heart into the role.  For all of you critics:  Lighten Up!!!  I'm fairly new to DW, but when I first came upon it I was expecting a serious, deep drama, and instead got served up some really stellar, shining moments on a bed of cheesy and only half believable plots.  But c'mon!  That's exactly what DW is suppose to be!  It's pre-watershed, as they say, which sets its own limits right there; and then there's my subcription that any show that can carry a villan as outlandishly corny as the Daleks all the way through--how many decades?--to an age of super CGI like we have today?  Well, folks, that's a wrap.  That says it all right there.

So, quit expecting this to be some epic series finale to end all series finales.  The show will go on.  We already know exactly how this is all going to turn out.  The real thing going on is all of David's fans getting to see him go out with a bang.  And despite all the poor reviews here, I still believe I will be overwhelmingly satisfied with RTD farewell to our favourite Doctor.

Louis Trapani's picture

As I said in the most recent Doctor Who: Podshock episodes (175 and 176), I don't believe it was clear at all what was going on with The Master in terms of his new "super powers."

There was the magic potion scene in which he is brought back into existence out of thin air and the process was interrupted by Lucy with her magic anti-potion. The scene ends there. As far as we know, that was it for The Master again.

When we do see him again, he has these powers. Sure, we have seen regenerations previously with supernatural forces encompassing the Doctor during the process... but there was no regeneration seen here. I certainly did not see The Master coming back into existence as a regeneration. Perhaps it was meant be similar, but it was not made clear.

It was not clear why he had these powers from this episode alone. Perhaps it is explained better in the Confidential episode or the audio commentary, but one should not have to resort to other resources to explain what should be explained within the episode itself.

If The Master was ripped opened, Part 1 of the story did not make it clear... We are left guessing on why he is the way he is... (super powers, growling, and exposing his innards).

Ironically, I was saying they over-explained things too much in The Waters of Mars, and here I am saying the opposite for The End of Time, Part 1.

Cheers,
Louis

Troy Baker's picture

Don't forget that this a two-part story. Granted there are many unanswered questions, but perhaps they will be answered in the conclusion of the story.

Why don't we wait and see. There might be more surprises in store (not counting the regeneration).

Speaking of the second part - the story's conclusion is tommorrow (Jan 1) on BBC and Saturday on BBC America.

Louis Trapani's picture

Yes. Sure, that is what I said in the podcasts as well. That is why I didn't want to rate Part 1 because it felt like seeing only the first half of a movie. Let's see what Part 2 has in store for us.

Though I still feel like there is a piece of storytelling missing from part 1 involving The Master... We will see if Part 2 does anything in regards to better explaining his situation.

Well, we will all know soon enough.

Happy New Year (and new regeneration).

Cheers,
Louis

That all this special effect stuff just makes DW seem silly. In the past it was the "shakey sets" that everyone would point to and say it was a silly series, but the underlying stories were cool if you followed them, and the aliens and strange planets all were cool and creative. Now the series seems to be moving away from that kind of stuff and into modern FX to attract fans.The special powers made no sense to me, even with the explanations above. I mean the jumps did not really help him get anywhere, the lightening did not really do any damage, or further his cause or anything.

I don't get the change from "Time Lord Victorious" to "time lord afraid to regenerate". I understand why he might not want to regenerate, but then why intrioduce the whole "Time Lord Victorious" in WoM at all. Just maks the Dr. seem emotionally unstable. Oh, sorry Wilf, I enjoyed our chat now I have to go save the world again, 'sniff'.

I agree with Louis, thre is just some simple basic points of story telling missing from this ep. Even if they are explained in pt 2, they thould not have left viewers so in the dark in this part.

I liked WoM, and find the episodes to be hit or miss each time.

Overall, from my limited view point I see the differences from old series to new to be.

- Old Dr. would always seem to make the rescue at the last second, the new Dr. seems to fail at preventing much and then doing clean up. (Only so many reset buttons I can take.)

- Old Dr. series seemed to cut away from the Dr. and develop the plot he is trying to stop while he tries to piece it together, the new Dr. does lots of running.(The Dr. in suit and coat chasing the Master that looks headed to the gym looked silly.)

- Old Dr. did more on other worlds, the new Dr. constantly on Earth makes many of the tricks they use to seem more silly then they would if they happened on a different world. This is even more the case in episodes that take place in the modern times using modern references.

- Old Dr. seemed less well known. New Dr. seems very popular as is his identity as not being from earth.

Oh, well, lets see what part 2 brings, and then the new series. With some luck things will get good again, or we can just resign ourselves to watching a modern tv series that is good for a few seasons till it jumps the shark. (I think DW jumped the shark a while ago, the first time the world wide reset button was used.)

 

For all of you who are lost and confused, please try this:

Go back and watch the first half of Torchwood Children of Earth Day 5, and only the the first half of day 5. Then try to make sence of what you just watched.

Taken out of context everything is silly, stupid and misunderstood.

Take Doctor Who for what it is. Primarily targeted to the same audience as (I cant beieve I am saying this) Star Wars. And from what I am reading, most people might be better suited to stick with The Sarah Jane Adventures.

The Phoenix
Idiom's picture

Happy 2010 Guys.

Wow, what a devicise epsiode.

I fall in the Love it category and I am really looking forward to tonight.

For me, the story worked within the Doctor Who universe. Even the change in the Master - he's a time lord - we know very little of time lord physiology except that they can possess people (given the right circumstances), turn into snake like creatures and now apparently burn up like a dying star shooting energy in all directions. For me, this was quite easy to infer from the story. And yes, ok it was inference, but quite a few friends who are not hard core fans loved it and inferred the same. He's an alien! 

Hoping that part 2 will confound all the critics. Well, we're all hoping that, aren't we? And really looking forward to the Matt Smith era while still enjoying Doctor Ten (like reading a  good book and looking forward to the next good one on the shelf).

Hope you all enjoy it.

Here's my take on the Master's regeneration.  I'm only somewhat familiar with the earlier Doctor Who novels (between the classic and new series) having read only a couple of them myself, however I know one thing which was presupposed in some of them was the concept of "Looms."  I think Lungbarrow (which was one I did read) in particular, relied on part in this, in which Time Lords are created from genetic material in these "Looms" rather than being born or hatched as most species.  I think, given that RTD is a self-confessed fan (in fact didn't he write one or more of the novels himself, I thought I had heard?), I'm sure he is aware of this idea from the novels and perhaps this was his inspiration behind the Master's resurrection.  It could be that the "secret books of Saxon" were simply imparting various elements of loom technology - if so, then that explains (at least good enough for me) the Master's resurrection.

As for the superpowers, I am happy to take that as just an after effect of the leaking regeneration energy (or else whatever energy from the botched resurrection/loom/whatever process).

Having said that, I totally agree with Louis that they did not explain sufficiently (if at all) in the episode ITSELF.  The episode itself you are just supposed to come away with "well, he's alien" which I dont think is explanation enough.  It's all very well for fans like us to analyse it, or come up with material from other sources, but they should have explained MUCH better in the episode itself, rather than going all Hogwarts.

I myself am OK with the resurrection and the superpowers, because as a fan who over-analyses things, I've come up with my own explanation that satisfies me, but they really did a terrible job explaining it in the episode itself.

Maybe they will explain or touch on it in part 2 this afternoon - but I am not holding my breath.  I think we need Star Trek Voyager to swoop in and provide some appropriate technobabble to explain everything ;-P

ssaattbb's picture

Hmmm... could his character possibly be Lord President Valeyard???

"The Master.......... I could explain a bit about what is going on with him, but I think it would just go over your head."

Just to pull one example...

Was it really necessary to make this many points to show yourself being an egotistical jerk?

Okay, just watched it again. First time thought it was 'okay', wish it could've been better..second viewing..okay it's really..really good!

I'd suggest anyone having a problem with part one watch it again.

First of all, I'm with Romana_II.  I love every episode of Doctor Who ever made. I even watched the sub-par tele-movie 3 times. It always has been and always will be my favourite show. It's Doctor Who for christ's sake so of course I'm going to enjoy it! I'm easily pleased when it comes to entertainment. My brain automatically zeroes in on the positives and pushes the negatives to the background. Unfortunately, most people are the opposite and it really shows with all the negativity on this and every other forum of its kind. It's a shame!

I just spent the last 3 days watching the incredible Children of the Earth (which almost made me cry in Episode 5) and The End of the Time. I got sick of waiting for the Australian ABC to air them.

TEOT Part 1 - Not great but good. The first 3rd was stock-standard stuff with Ood and the Master's resurrection. Then we get the Doc and Wilf together which is one of the best pairings since Doc 9 and Rose. And we get to see Donna again which is great.

As for the Master: In Season 3 I thought Simm did a decent job but I couldn't wrap my head around a neurotic Master and RTD injected way too much silliness into the script. This time RTD sent the Master over the deep end and I felt it worked a lot better.

I was watching this in my room and when I saw the Timelords would return at the end I shouted with glee, forgetting there were other people in the house :)

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